There are so many variables that go into making a PIZZA. The hydration of the dough, flour, yeast and many more.. Amounts of any kind of yeast in a pizza can make a big difference. Most recipes posted on the web, use too much yeast in their recipes. What I have found out so far, is either bulk fermenting the dough or cold fermenting the dough will give a better flavor in the crust. I am still experimenting to find different flavors in the crust of pies. In my opinion pizza is all about the best flavor you can achieve in a crust. I still am on the journey about flavors in the crust. Even differences in temperatures in you home or times of the year can influence how much yeast to use. If you want a pizza to develop flavors in the crust, there are many ways to go about achieving this.


Preferment for Lehmann Dough Pizzas

Crust of Pizza

Crust of Pizza
Rim of Preferment Lehmann Formula

Adventure in Pizza Making

There are many ways to go about trying to make any kind of pizzas you want to create. PIZZA making is fun and also you get to eat your finished product. I learned to make all my pizza on http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php If you look on pizzamaking.com you can see all the beautiful creations of pizzas members make on this site. Members and moderators help members and guests achieve almost any kind of pizzas they want to create. Since joining this site, my pizza making skills have gone from non-existent to something much better. I invite you to take a look at this site.

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Sicilian Pizza

Sicilian Pizza
Sicilian Pizza with Preferment for Lehmann Dough

At my mom's home getting ready to bake in her gas oven

At my mom's home getting ready to bake in her gas oven
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Thursday, December 16, 2010

Second Attempt for a Bittman’s pizza No Yeast 4/11/2010

This was my second attempt to make a pizza out of Bittman's dough recipe with no yeast.

I copied what Peter (Pete-zza) posted to me on pizzamaking.com and what I posted back.


Whenever I practice a new dough recipe for the first time, I try not to freelance and I take a lot of notes to review once the pizzas have been made. Freelancing can come after I see the types of results the recipe produces. However, even in such cases, some modifications may become necessary. For example, in the case of the Bittman matzo dough recipe, the flour and water are given in volume measurements and we don't even know what kind or brand of flour is used. So, some adjustment of the flour and/or water in the mixer bowl may become necessary. In the Bittman video, the flour, water and oil are mixed at normal processor speed for about 14-16 seconds. That is what I would do using a food processor. If my results don't look like the results shown in the video, I would make adjustments to the flour and water as necessary. This can be done in the food processor or by hand on the bench. I think I would also sift the flour before placing it into the food processor. That should help improve the hydration of the flour by "squeezing" more water into the flour.

Once the dough has been prepared, I would then decide on what size and shape of pizza I want to make with this dough, how many skins I want to superimpose on each other, and which of the two Bittman thickness factors should be used. I believe this is what hotsawce had in mind in his earlier posts although he may have been thinking more about a couple of Bittman skins of around 6"-8" rather than a rectangular pizza, and maybe with the lower thickness factor. But, once the dough has been made, one can go in either direction provided that the proper amount of dough is used to be faithful to the Bittman dough recipe. As an example using your 11" x 17" rectangular pan, and assuming that you want to use two skins with a thickness factor of 0.047832, the amount of dough you would want to use is given in the following dough formulation produced using the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html:

King Arthur All-Purpose Flour (100%):
Water (44.3017%):
Morton's Kosher Salt (1.04516%):
Olive Oil (26.9653%):
Total (172.31216%):
Single Ball:
297.26 g  |  10.49 oz | 0.66 lbs
131.69 g  |  4.65 oz | 0.29 lbs
3.11 g | 0.11 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.65 tsp | 0.22 tbsp
80.16 g | 2.83 oz | 0.18 lbs | 5.94 tbsp | 0.37 cups
512.21 g | 18.07 oz | 1.13 lbs | TF = 0.0483083
256.1 g | 9.03 oz | 0.56 lbs
Note: Nominal thickness factor = 0.04783; for two 12" x 17" rectangular skins; bowl residue compensation = 1%

You will note that I added a bowl residue compensation of 1%, which from my experience appears to be a good value for a food processor.

Of course, if one wants to make a round pizza following the same protocol of two skins using a thickness factor of 0.04783, the expanded dough calculating tool will provide the required amounts of ingredients. For example, for a 12" pizza using two superimposed skins, the dough formulation looks like this:

King Arthur All-Purpose Flour (100%):
Water (44.3017%):
Morton's Kosher Salt (1.04516%):
Olive Oil (26.9653%):
Total (172.31216%):
Single Ball:
179.78 g  |  6.34 oz | 0.4 lbs
79.65 g  |  2.81 oz | 0.18 lbs
1.88 g | 0.07 oz | 0 lbs | 0.39 tsp | 0.13 tbsp
48.48 g | 1.71 oz | 0.11 lbs | 10.77 tsp | 3.59 tbsp
309.78 g | 10.93 oz | 0.68 lbs | TF = 0.0483083
154.89 g | 5.46 oz | 0.34 lbs
Note: Nominal thickness factor = 0.04783; for two 12" skins; bowl residue compensation = 1%

You will also note that in the above examples I used Morton's Kosher salt since that is what you used in your last experiment. Clearly, as long as the baker's percent for the salt is kept the same, the expanded dough calculating tool can be used for other salt types. The tool can also be used with the other thickness factor (0.026905) if one wants to make a really thin crust, even with two layers. If it turns out that the amount of dough is too small to make in a food processor (which would also rule out a stand mixer), then one can resort to making the dough by hand. For those who are interested, the ingredients for a 12" pizza with two skins using a thickness factor of 0.026905 would be as follows:

King Arthur All-Purpose Flour (100%):
Water (44.3017%):
Morton's Kosher Salt (1.04516%):
Olive Oil (26.9653%):
Total (172.31216%):
Single Ball:
101.13 g  |  3.57 oz | 0.22 lbs
44.8 g  |  1.58 oz | 0.1 lbs
1.06 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.22 tsp | 0.07 tbsp
27.27 g | 0.96 oz | 0.06 lbs | 6.06 tsp | 2.02 tbsp
174.26 g | 6.15 oz | 0.38 lbs | TF = 0.0271741
87.13 g | 3.07 oz | 0.19 lbs
Note: Nominal thickness factor = 0.026905; for two 12" skins; bowl residue compensation = 1%

I think I would personally try making something like a single 12" pizza with two layers, using either thickness factor, and with a modest amount of cheese and toppings (but not too sparse), in order to see if preBittman dough recipe when used to make a cracker-style pizza.



I had planned on making a total of two doughs, but decided to just try one dough at a time.  I will try the dark 12" deep-dish pan this time.  I have used this pan for different kinds of pies, but not a cracker-style pie.

This is the formula I am using for this test.

Bittman’s Dough

Flour (100%):            179.31 g  |  6.32 oz | 0.4 lbs
Water (44.3017%):      79.44 g  |  2.8 oz | 0.18 lbs
Salt (1.5%):                 2.69 g | 0.09 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.56 tsp | 0.19 tbsp
Olive Oil (26.9653%):     48.35 g | 1.71 oz | 0.11 lbs | 10.74 tsp | 3.58 tbsp
Total (172.767%):     309.78 g | 10.93 oz | 0.68 lbs | TF = 0.0483083
Single Ball:                     154.89 g | 5.46 oz | 0.34 lbs

The 12" Bittman’s Matzo Pizza worked out well,.  The dough came together well when mixing by hand. There was no need to add any extra flour today. Thanks to Peter’s advise on using a sifter. I mixed the salt in with the olive oil and water.  I didn’t warm the water up today and just used it at room temperature.  I used a whisk to mix the water, salt, and olive oil together and then just mixed in the flour in another bowl.

I divided the dough into two balls for a super-imposed two layer pizza.  The dough was so easy to roll out with all the extra olive oil.  I rolled it out a little more than 12" so I could have a rim.  The dough was super thin, but there wasn’t any problems transferring it to the deep-dish pan.  After rolling out one dough ball, I applied melted butter to the first skin.  Then rolled out the second skin and put it on top of the first skin.  A fork was used to dock the first skin and then the second skin.  I cut a little extra dough off the deep-dish pan because there was a little to much dough to form the rim.  I did oil the deep-dish pan some, but wasn’t sure how much to oil it.

I decided to dress this pie differently than the last pie.  This Bittman’s Matzo Pie was dress with a garlic white sauce, that I had wanted to try for a couple of weeks that I read about on PMQTT.  Since it sounded tasty so I gave it a try and only made half of the recipe.
http://www.pmq.com/tt/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8804&p=59860&hilit=white+pizza#p59842 The other dressings were fresh parsley and chives I picked from my garden, diced mozzarella, fried bacon, Red Cow Parmesan Cheese I had mixed into the garlic white sauce and finally I sprinkled some Italian Seasoning over the top.

The pie was baked at 475 for 10 minutes.  I saw the bottom wasn't getting too brown and the top was soon going to be finished, so I took the pie out of the deep-dish pan and transferred it onto the stone for the final bake of about 4 minutes.

In my opinion this pie was better than the first.  I liked the added salt to the dough. This pie was very flaky and tasty.  I think anyone could take this formula and give it a try.

Thanks Peter for helping me out on how to go about making the Bittman’s Pizza.


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