There are so many variables that go into making a PIZZA. The hydration of the dough, flour, yeast and many more.. Amounts of any kind of yeast in a pizza can make a big difference. Most recipes posted on the web, use too much yeast in their recipes. What I have found out so far, is either bulk fermenting the dough or cold fermenting the dough will give a better flavor in the crust. I am still experimenting to find different flavors in the crust of pies. In my opinion pizza is all about the best flavor you can achieve in a crust. I still am on the journey about flavors in the crust. Even differences in temperatures in you home or times of the year can influence how much yeast to use. If you want a pizza to develop flavors in the crust, there are many ways to go about achieving this.


Preferment for Lehmann Dough Pizzas

Crust of Pizza

Crust of Pizza
Rim of Preferment Lehmann Formula

Adventure in Pizza Making

There are many ways to go about trying to make any kind of pizzas you want to create. PIZZA making is fun and also you get to eat your finished product. I learned to make all my pizza on http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php If you look on pizzamaking.com you can see all the beautiful creations of pizzas members make on this site. Members and moderators help members and guests achieve almost any kind of pizzas they want to create. Since joining this site, my pizza making skills have gone from non-existent to something much better. I invite you to take a look at this site.

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Sicilian Pizza

Sicilian Pizza
Sicilian Pizza with Preferment for Lehmann Dough

At my mom's home getting ready to bake in her gas oven

At my mom's home getting ready to bake in her gas oven
click on picture to go to post

Tuesday, December 7, 2010

Next Attempt with “wild yeast” Starter in a Sicilian pie, with comments from Toby and Matt 1/21/10

These are some pictures of the higher hydration dough I made in Janurary 2010 with one of the starters that Toby helped me with.  I used high gluten flour and mixed with the natural starter (wild yeast), that was made with rye flour and then fed with Caputo.
The flour and natural starter were mixed with my Hamilton Beach mixer.  You can see the pictures of how the dough looks.  The dough with starter is going to be left out at room temperature for 24 hours to ferment.
The last two pictures were after the dough was fermenting for 3 hours.
I will post pictures whether the Tomato Pie turns out well or not.

The pie is finished using the natural starter made with rye and then fed with Caputo.  Thanks so much to Toby, that helped me though the process of trying a starter and taking me step by step in the process.

The pie turned out delicious.  It was almost what I was trying to achieve.  The only thing I want to change the next time I try this Sfincione type Focaccia would be to try an aluminum pan to bake the pie.  I wasn’t satisfied with how the black pan baked the dough.  I had to take the partially baked dough out of the pan and put it onto the screen to achieve a more crispy crust.  I did use olive oil in the pan, but can’t figure out if it was the pan or what.  The last time 2 times I baked the Sfincione type Focaccia in the aluminum pan, there wasn’t any problems with the crust browning.

The pie was dressed with fresh mozzarella I had frozen. (Terry) tdeane, helped me though that process.  The other two cheeses used in the pie were Parmesan grated and regular Parmesan.  I used my regular sauce that I make each week which also was frozen.  I caramelized onions again because we really liked the taste of them, before.  Panko bread flakes were also used mixed with olive oil, Italian seasoning and oregano.

The pie was parbaked at 450 degrees F for 10 minutes.  Then the dressing were added.

This pie had the airy crust, that I wanted.

This is the formula I used.  I used the Preferment Calculating Tool to figure out how much dough I thought I would need.  It still is confusing to me, but worked out okay.  I am still learning all this math stuff and calculating.

Total Formula:
Flour (100%):    488.62 g  |  17.24 oz | 1.08 lbs
Water (75%):    366.46 g  |  12.93 oz | 0.81 lbs
Salt (1.5%):    7.33 g | 0.26 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.53 tsp | 0.51 tbsp
Total (176.5%):   862.41 g | 30.42 oz | 1.9 lbs | TF = 0.13

Preferment: Natural starter Toby’s rye fed with caputo total 19.18 used for preferment
Flour:    18.91 g | 0.67 oz | 0.04 lbs          This part may not be right..but I used total 19.18 g
Water:    0.27 g | 0.01 oz | 0 lbs                 of preferment when measuring.
Total:    19.18 g | 0.68 oz | 0.04 lbs

Final Dough:
Flour:    469.71 g | 16.57 oz | 1.04 lbs
Water:    366.19 g | 12.92 oz | 0.81 lbs
Salt:    7.33 g | 0.26 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.53 tsp | 0.51 tbsp
Preferment:    19.18 g | 0.68 oz | 0.04 lbs
Total:    862.41 g | 30.42 oz | 1.9 lbs  | TF = 0.13

This is what Toby (Infoodel, foolish poolish), Matt and I posted on pizzamaking.com  after I made the pie.

I'm curious how long it took to proof/rise.


Thanks, I let it rise at room temperature for 24 hours.  If I guess right it rose about triple or more.  I took the dough out of the glass container and then put it into the plastic container which I had oiled with olive oil for the 24 hour ferment. How long do you let you dough rise and do you cold ferment at all with the natural starters?
I appreciate you taking me though the process of starters so I could make a pie like this.
Anymore questions, just ask, you helped me so much.

24 hours sounds reasonable for the level of starter you're using in the final dough.
You're probably aware I've got a bit of a soft spot for using levain/preferments rather than the marathon rise of a 'direct dough'. I almost never cold ferment - but that has more to do with my levain approach than anything. If I were to refrigerate my final dough with the percentage of preferment I typically use, I would likely end up with quite a sour tasting end result.



I used high-gluten flour KASL for the dough part.  The natural starter was first made with rye flour and then when the starter was thriving, kept feeding with Antimo Caputo tip "00".  I thought there wouldn't be enough strength in the dough part if I used the Antimo Caputo tip "00" for the dough part.  Since my old oven (33 years old) won't get above 450 degrees F, even if left on for more than one hour, that I probably would need more strength in the dough portion.  I will have to try this recipe again with another flour or flours in the dough part and see what happens.  I had used the aluminum pan before when making the other two pies and didn't have any problems with the dough browning on the bottom.

What I found most interesting was how well the natural starter helped the dough to rise.  I had never tried a natural starter for anything before, but was pleasantly surprised that it did help the dough rise.
Toby understands more about natural starters than I do.  Maybe he could answer your question better than I can.  Did you see the Nearyneapolitan he made.  It looked exactly like a Neapolitan pie and he made the pie in a home oven.

I will post the next few attempts, in the coming days.  The journey continues.....................................


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